<div dir="ltr"><div>Hello All,</div><div><br></div><div>thanks for the discussion.</div><div>Andrea -- indeed, we have spoken about the possible census. I am not sure if we decided something, but indeed, I would also prefer to have it in the survey EoI - the reason being that, for the monitoring, I'd prefer to keep topics that require long-term campaigns. However, we can discuss about it. I am not adverse to a "Census EoI", as there are many other science topics that would use single-shot and maybe long-track observations (e.g., single pulse analysis and alike)</div><div>Aris -- we will make sure of helping each other targets :-) <br></div><div><br></div><div>Cheers</div><div>Caterina<br></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, 10 Nov 2021 at 11:01, Aris Karastergiou <<a href="mailto:aris.karastergiou@physics.ox.ac.uk">aris.karastergiou@physics.ox.ac.uk</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
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Hi guys,</div>
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I am following this conversation with interest. I think the key will be in the details. For MeerKAT, we opted for a single long (to get enough single pulses) pass of 1000+ sources, which didn't take up that much time, followed by monthly monitoring of several
hundred, with the minimum integration time that gives us good fidelity. The value of 8h per source can be debated.</div>
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The high-level arguments about the science you are putting forward are interesting, but ultimately the objectives of searching and timing are the same: to understand pulsars and where they sit in a variety of problems in physics. In my opinion therefore, these
campaigns need to be optimized in a practical way, maximizing the return from each and helping each other's objectives. </div>
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Not particularly useful, but those are my thoughts anyway.</div>
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Cheers,</div>
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Aris</div>
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<div id="gmail-m_8455511198745159968divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font style="font-size:11pt" face="Calibri, sans-serif" color="#000000"><b>From:</b> lofarpwg <<a href="mailto:lofarpwg-bounces@astron.nl" target="_blank">lofarpwg-bounces@astron.nl</a>> on behalf of Possenti, Andrea <<a href="mailto:andrea.possenti@inaf.it" target="_blank">andrea.possenti@inaf.it</a>><br>
<b>Sent:</b> 10 November 2021 09:04<br>
<b>To:</b> Joris Verbiest <<a href="mailto:joris.verbiest@gmail.com" target="_blank">joris.verbiest@gmail.com</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href="mailto:fgl2bf@astron.nl" target="_blank">fgl2bf@astron.nl</a> <<a href="mailto:fgl2bf@astron.nl" target="_blank">fgl2bf@astron.nl</a>>; Alessandro Ridolfi <<a href="mailto:alessandro.ridolfi@inaf.it" target="_blank">alessandro.ridolfi@inaf.it</a>>; Ziggy Pleunis <<a href="mailto:ziggypleunis@gmail.com" target="_blank">ziggypleunis@gmail.com</a>>; <a href="mailto:e.vanderwateren@science.ru.nl" target="_blank">e.vanderwateren@science.ru.nl</a> <<a href="mailto:e.vanderwateren@science.ru.nl" target="_blank">e.vanderwateren@science.ru.nl</a>>; <a href="mailto:lofarpwg@astron.nl" target="_blank">lofarpwg@astron.nl</a> <<a href="mailto:lofarpwg@astron.nl" target="_blank">lofarpwg@astron.nl</a>>; Pilia, Maura <<a href="mailto:maura.pilia@inaf.it" target="_blank">maura.pilia@inaf.it</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Lofarpwg] LOFAR2.0 PSR/FRB/Fast Transients EoIs</font>
<div> </div>
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<div>hi Joris and Cees,</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I really do not disagree with any of you and I see good reasons for both visions.
<br>
</div>
<div>Science-wise I'm more on Cees' (and my original) view (most science, with some notable</div>
<div>exceptions, is overlapping among monitoring and long tracks on known sources, although on different timescales),
<br>
</div>
<div>while on the implementation plan, I'm much more inclined on Joris' view, especially since</div>
<div>doing 1000 sources with the monitoring will be practically very hard if not impossible.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Maybe an intermediate option could be to ask for the Census-1000 pulsars as a "piggy</div>
<div>back" program for the survey EoI, while keeping the description of the related science
<br>
</div>
<div>and motivations in the "monitoring" EoI. <br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Anyway, just a second order thing. What's important is to have that implemented somewhere.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Andrea</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
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<div>
<div dir="ltr">Il giorno mer 10 nov 2021 alle ore 09:54 Joris Verbiest <<a href="mailto:joris.verbiest@gmail.com" target="_blank">joris.verbiest@gmail.com</a>> ha scritto:<br>
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<div>Hi Cees,</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Just to quickly point out that I don't think I agree.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I do agree that scientifically there is a match with some of the science goals of the monitoring campaign and those of the long-track census; but at the same time a major goal of pulsar surveys is exactly charting the population of source out there --
meaning that there is an excellent scientific match there as well.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Also, in terms of required observations, the survey and the long-track census are perfectly matched, whereas the difference with the monitoring campaign could not be larger.
<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>So I personally very much think the long-track census would be a logical part of the survey EoI -- but not of the monitoring EoI.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Cheers,</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Joris<br>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div>
<div dir="ltr">On Tue, 9 Nov 2021 at 20:38, Cees Bassa <<a href="mailto:bassa@astron.nl" target="_blank">bassa@astron.nl</a>> wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
Hi Andrea,<br>
<br>
On Mon, 2021-11-08 at 23:07 +0100, Possenti, Andrea wrote:<br>
> I think that reading also the similar doc for the monitor EoI will be<br>
> beneficial to answer your questions.<br>
> At the moment, I'm just wondering if the 2nd sub-theme in the search<br>
> EoI might not be more appropriate<br>
> for the parallel monitor program. Of course one can sell that as a<br>
> "search" for single pulses and other<br>
> as yet unassessed phenomenologies, but at the very end the telescope<br>
> will look at already known sources.<br>
<br>
Looking at the notes I took of both the searching and monitoring<br>
discussions, the "1000 pulsar census with 8h per source" was mentioned<br>
as part of the monitoring program. To me that seems the logical<br>
location to add this; it is a bit different to the monitoring done for<br>
timing, but it is a better match than searching.<br>
<br>
Regards,<br>
Cees<br>
<br>
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</blockquote></div><br clear="all"><br>-- <br><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><span style="color:rgb(68,68,68)">Dr. Caterina Tiburzi<br>Post-doctoral researcher</span></div><div dir="ltr"><span style="color:rgb(68,68,68)">Veni fellow</span></div><div dir="ltr"><span style="color:rgb(68,68,68)"><br></span></div><div><span style="color:rgb(68,68,68)">ASTRON, the Netherlands Institute for Radio Astronomy</span></div><div><span style="color:rgb(68,68,68)">Oude Hoogeveensedijk 4, 7991 PD</span></div><div><span style="color:rgb(68,68,68)">Dwingeloo, the Netherlands<br></span></div><div><span style="color:rgb(68,68,68)"><br></span></div><div><span style="color:rgb(68,68,68)">E-mail: <a href="mailto:tiburzi@astron.nl" target="_blank">tiburzi@astron.nl</a><br></span></div><div><span style="color:rgb(68,68,68)">Telephone: 0031 (0)521 595 773<br></span></div><div><span style="color:rgb(68,68,68)">Skype: caterina.tiburzi84<br></span></div><div dir="ltr"><span style="color:rgb(68,68,68)"><br></span><br></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>